CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

This forum is for the discussion of the scanning and monitoring of Massachusetts statewide agencies.
User avatar
Thunderbolt
Posts: 219
Joined: 22 Oct 2005 02:13
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan

CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by Thunderbolt »

I see that CoMIRS officials have filed several license applications with the FCC, to convert the existing legacy Type-II TRS, into the new P25 system in eastern Massachusetts. Is it safe to say that all of these new sites are going to be P25 Phase-II simulcast cells?

https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/Applic ... D=12619145

https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/Applic ... D=12615263

https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/Applic ... D=12615264

https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/Applic ... D=12615450

https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/Applic ... D=12617693

https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/Applic ... D=12617694

https://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/Applic ... D=12620264

73's

Ron
"Enjoy and explore our nation's U.S. Highway System, you'll be richer for the endless experiences that await you!"

CG
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 1347
Joined: 29 Aug 2005 15:46
Location: Granby, CT

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by CG »

The entire state will be P25 Phase 2 so any changes, construction, or improvements would be with that as the goal. Contract calls for completion to be December 2025 with parts going in service at various intervals prior to that.
The bidding for the project is not yet complete, no vendor has yet been chosen. That should happen by 7/1/21

chris

User avatar
W1KNE
Owner-Webmaster
Posts: 5196
Joined: 19 Aug 2005 12:00
Location: Taunton, MA
Contact:

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by W1KNE »

I created a wiki place holder page with those frequencies licensed, that we can add more to when they are done.
Obviously this is very fluid.
Mike Fitzpatrick
Broadcast Engineer - RF Enthusiast - Municipal Fire Alarm Collector
Owner: Scan New England - NECRAT.US
Issues with Scan New England can be privately addressed to me.

garys
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 4067
Joined: 29 Aug 2005 13:07

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by garys »

I won't be surprised if it's 2026 or 2027. Once the contract is awarded, the is a lot more paperwork to be done.
We're peace loving people, we're not hunting trouble, but if trouble should find us, we'll stand up and fight.

LD723
Posts: 39
Joined: 10 May 2020 19:39

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by LD723 »

I am not super knowledgeable on this system when it comes to vendors but, why would the vendor be different than the western mass counterpart? Are they handling comirs' vendors differently in Eastern mass than western mass? I always believed it was going to be a carbon copy from western mass to Eastern mass when it came to vendors at least for the state police. I'm sure municipalities will join the system with different radios but I always believed the base of the system was Motorola. This is all speculation by me of course

Tim
Posts: 286
Joined: 29 Aug 2005 18:05
Location: Fall River,MA
Contact:

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by Tim »

I didn't notice any Southeastern Mass. locations. I think Fall River PD is waiting for the CoMirs system for it's P-25 upgrade. They are putting in a microwave system for the fire and police departments here in the city. :Bruins:
BCD996P2, PSR-600, Pro-2006, TRX-1, Par Mon-3 antenna - home, Gemtronics 800 mhz antenna - handheld, David Clark headset, :Bruins:

CG
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 1347
Joined: 29 Aug 2005 15:46
Location: Granby, CT

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by CG »

With the P25 standard, there are more players who can deliver the same system (in theory). It may well be Motorola but the others will have a shot. Once everybody is pre-qualified for the project, they they will bid on the actual system.
The bid documents aren't supposed to be tailored to a single manufacturer. Pick a feature that only one vendor had would lock out everybody else. You know:
2.4.5a The word "Motorola" on the front of the radio shall be no smaller than .25 inch high.

chris

garys
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 4067
Joined: 29 Aug 2005 13:07

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by garys »

There will likely be more applications filed to cover that area.
Tim wrote:
04 Apr 2021 10:57
I didn't notice any Southeastern Mass. locations. I think Fall River PD is waiting for the CoMirs system for it's P-25 upgrade. They are putting in a microwave system for the fire and police departments here in the city. :Bruins:
We're peace loving people, we're not hunting trouble, but if trouble should find us, we'll stand up and fight.

ScanBoston
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 3483
Joined: 19 Aug 2005 12:00
Location: Boston Area
Contact:

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by ScanBoston »

LD723 wrote:
02 Apr 2021 23:04
I am not super knowledgeable on this system when it comes to vendors but, why would the vendor be different than the western mass counterpart? Are they handling comirs' vendors differently in Eastern mass than western mass? I always believed it was going to be a carbon copy from western mass to Eastern mass when it came to vendors at least for the state police. I'm sure municipalities will join the system with different radios but I always believed the base of the system was Motorola. This is all speculation by me of course
Phase 2 is already a difference. Western MA is Phase 1.

garys
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 4067
Joined: 29 Aug 2005 13:07

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by garys »

Because of the way state bidding and contract laws work. I won't bore you with the details, but consider that there were probably 100 different contracts for the Big Dig, not one big one.

When central MA gets upgraded, the process will likely be repeated.
LD723 wrote:
02 Apr 2021 23:04
I am not super knowledgeable on this system when it comes to vendors but, why would the vendor be different than the western mass counterpart? Are they handling comirs' vendors differently in Eastern mass than western mass? I always believed it was going to be a carbon copy from western mass to Eastern mass when it came to vendors at least for the state police. I'm sure municipalities will join the system with different radios but I always believed the base of the system was Motorola. This is all speculation by me of course
We're peace loving people, we're not hunting trouble, but if trouble should find us, we'll stand up and fight.

LD723
Posts: 39
Joined: 10 May 2020 19:39

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by LD723 »

ScanBoston wrote:
05 Apr 2021 11:34
Phase 2 is already a difference. Western MA is Phase 1.
Sorry for my ignorance but, would that mean mass state police could possibly have harris or whatever P25 Phase 2 capable radios out in Eastern ma? That would be pretty interesting. They may want a P25 phase 2 system but I feel like they would possibly start off on phase 1 like many other systems, and sooner or later hop on Phase 2 to work out bugs. It is possible they could just jump the gun and start off on Phase 2 but time will tell. Nonetheless, all of this info you guys have put here is awesome like this website :D

CG
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 1347
Joined: 29 Aug 2005 15:46
Location: Granby, CT

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by CG »

Once the municipalities start coming onto the system, it will load more and more. The availability of 7/800 MHz channels is limited in many areas and the only way to have increased capacity would be to switch to Phase 2 and double the capacity of a Phase 1 system.
The Franklin County departments are being offered Kenwood or Motorola radios for CoMIRS.

ScanBoston
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 3483
Joined: 19 Aug 2005 12:00
Location: Boston Area
Contact:

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by ScanBoston »

I don't think there is any plan to put municipalities on the system. Maybe a few here and there that ask to be but I think this is just really an upgrade of the current state agencies system.

User avatar
W1KNE
Owner-Webmaster
Posts: 5196
Joined: 19 Aug 2005 12:00
Location: Taunton, MA
Contact:

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by W1KNE »

ScanBoston wrote:
06 Apr 2021 06:28
I don't think there is any plan to put municipalities on the system. Maybe a few here and there that ask to be but I think this is just really an upgrade of the current state agencies system.
They've already begun putting them on the system. Aside from the legacy municipalities on the system (Rehoboth, Orange, Barnstable County various towns), with CoMIRS, Greenfield, Montague and Franklin County Dispatch all are now on it. The rumors of Ludlow and North Adams joining have also been around for a bit too. Plus if there is the capacity to do so, there is no reason to think why they wouldn't add them.
Mike Fitzpatrick
Broadcast Engineer - RF Enthusiast - Municipal Fire Alarm Collector
Owner: Scan New England - NECRAT.US
Issues with Scan New England can be privately addressed to me.

garys
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 4067
Joined: 29 Aug 2005 13:07

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by garys »

I wonder if any part of the planning of this involved the concern that the UHF-T band was scheduled to go away? A lot of PD and FD systems in eastern MA would have been affected by that.

I thought that the 700Mhz Overlay system might be part of a plan to establish an area wide trunked system.
We're peace loving people, we're not hunting trouble, but if trouble should find us, we'll stand up and fight.

LD723
Posts: 39
Joined: 10 May 2020 19:39

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by LD723 »

W1KNE wrote:
06 Apr 2021 07:06
They've already begun putting them on the system. Aside from the legacy municipalities on the system (Rehoboth, Orange, Barnstable County various towns), with CoMIRS, Greenfield, Montague and Franklin County Dispatch all are now on it. The rumors of Ludlow and North Adams joining have also been around for a bit too. Plus if there is the capacity to do so, there is no reason to think why they wouldn't add them.
Ludlow currently wants their own P25 system they already have some sort of contract/deal with Marcus Communications to build out a tait/harris system. It's very possible they can link it to Comirs.

ScanBoston
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 3483
Joined: 19 Aug 2005 12:00
Location: Boston Area
Contact:

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by ScanBoston »

It's just not built for that it doesn't have capacity or the portable coverage to support it. Your average city or town has 3 to 6 voting receivers to give them portable coverage they have. Imagine what the state would need to do have that. Always remember as well you can only have as many folks talking as you have voice channels after that busy signals. Think if you added just 3 or 4 towns or cities along with all that MSP, DOT, DEP, DCR, MEMA and Corrections traffic etc. The system would busy out often. There are massive statewide systems but they have to be built out that way from the ground up. This one never was it's designed for the State Police's and friends coverage needs.

User avatar
Thunderbolt
Posts: 219
Joined: 22 Oct 2005 02:13
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by Thunderbolt »

"Enjoy and explore our nation's U.S. Highway System, you'll be richer for the endless experiences that await you!"

CG
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 1347
Joined: 29 Aug 2005 15:46
Location: Granby, CT

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by CG »

The system is essentially being completely rebuilt. It has dozens of new sites and frequencies. Coverage will be augmented in many locations via vehicle repeaters.
If there is any doubt about the intended capacity of the system, look at the new licenses. 11 frequencies that are licensed for P25 Phase 2 which would allow for 20 simultaneous voice conversations.
The State of CT system carries local (PD, FD, EMS, DPW, buses), State (every agency from CSP to Medical Examiner), Military, and several Federal agencies. It also carries traffic from other trunked systems allowing them to have coverage over a much greater area. CT also has the ability for any local system to be patched into the State system or monitored remotely.

CW115
Posts: 234
Joined: 30 Jan 2008 13:42
Location: Plymouth MA & Wells ME
Contact:

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by CW115 »

I believe there were 700 Mhz frequencies licensed for many of the Eastern MA zone 5 and maybe zone 3 sites a while back, if I recall correctly.

Gordon

ScanBoston
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 3483
Joined: 19 Aug 2005 12:00
Location: Boston Area
Contact:

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by ScanBoston »

CW115 wrote:
07 Apr 2021 11:51
I believe there were 700 Mhz frequencies licensed for many of the Eastern MA zone 5 and maybe zone 3 sites a while back, if I recall correctly.

Gordon
Rumor has it as going away soon.

ScanBoston
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 3483
Joined: 19 Aug 2005 12:00
Location: Boston Area
Contact:

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by ScanBoston »

cdgordon wrote:
07 Apr 2021 10:13
The system is essentially being completely rebuilt. It has dozens of new sites and frequencies. Coverage will be augmented in many locations via vehicle repeaters.
If there is any doubt about the intended capacity of the system, look at the new licenses. 11 frequencies that are licensed for P25 Phase 2 which would allow for 20 simultaneous voice conversations.
The State of CT system carries local (PD, FD, EMS, DPW, buses), State (every agency from CSP to Medical Examiner), Military, and several Federal agencies. It also carries traffic from other trunked systems allowing them to have coverage over a much greater area. CT also has the ability for any local system to be patched into the State system or monitored remotely.
Not a chance of this happening here.

garys
Forums and Wiki Moderator
Posts: 4067
Joined: 29 Aug 2005 13:07

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by garys »

I thought that the current analog system has portable coverage within the I 495 loop.
We're peace loving people, we're not hunting trouble, but if trouble should find us, we'll stand up and fight.

jrm3607
Posts: 138
Joined: 21 Aug 2009 22:07
Location: Metro Boston
Contact:

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by jrm3607 »

Looking at the ULS it seems since this thread started the state has been granted 10 more additional liscenses for future P25 system, all with Emission 9K80D7W. Below are the new Callsigns, Site Locations and Frequencies.

WRMG312
99 SMITHVILLE ROAD SPENCER
224 OLD TOWN FARM ROAD BARRE
STERRAGE ROCK RD BRIMFIELD
RAGGED HILL WOODS RD WEST BROOKFIELD
LITTLE MUGGET HILL CHARLTON
MONSON TOWER MONSON
852.725 854.4125 854.9375 855.1125 855.3375 855.6375 855.8375 855.9125 857.3625 858.4125 859.4125

WRMH506
2.0 KM SE OF RT. 131 & OLD DUDLEY ROAD DUDLEY
SOUTHBRIDGE RD WARREN
5 Charlton Street STURBRIDGE
CT-171 HOLLAND MASS/UNION UNION, CT
MA-19 SOUTH & OAK HAVEN CAMP GROUND WALES
852.725 854.4125 854.9375 855.1125 855.3375 855.6375 855.8375 855.9125 857.3625 858.4125 859.4125

WRMG321
18 MANNING AVENUE MIDDLETON
2.3 SE ROCKPORTMILES OFF THATCHER ROAD ROCKPORT
OFF MA-133 W 1 MILE FROM ROWLEY ROWLEY
851.875 852.05 852.1375 852.575 852.725 853.075 853.225 853.5375 854.1125 854.9375 856.9625

WRMG881
PENNIMAN ST NEW BEDFORD
GREEN ST AND BERKLEY RR BERKLEY
MAIN ROAD .4 MILES WESTPORT
800 WARREN ST FALL RIVER
FIRE TOWER ROAD TO COPICUT HILL FALL RIVER
RESERVOIR AVE .5 MILES TO FIRE TOWER REHOBOTH
851.0375 851.75 852.0375 853.35 853.475 856.2125 857.0375 857.9625 858.0625

WRMG980
400 CEDAR ST ASHLAND
.2 MILES OFF ISAAC MILLER RD WESTBOROUGH
122 HIGHLAND STREET MILFORD
1.4 MILES NW OF NOBSCOTT SUDBURY
MOUNT NEBO WESTBOROUGH
852.8875 854.3625 854.5625 855.1375 855.2125 855.6125 856.9875 857.7125

WRMI343
.2 MILES OFF PINE ST MIDDLEBOROUGH
70 PLEASANT STREET WEST BRIDGEWATER
821 CENTER ST BROCKTON
S END OF INDUSTRIAL BLVD 1320 FEET E OF RT 27 HANSON
31 MONKS HILL ROAD KINGSTON
HIGHWAY 28 & WEST GROVE ST MIDDLEBOROUGH
852.7125 853.1375 853.3125 853.3875 854.0875 854.6125 855.3375 857.2375 858.0875 858.3625 859.3375

WRMI362
MEETING HOUSE HILL, CUSHING ST ASHBURNHAM
MA-62 WEST AND TAYLOR ROAD BERLIN
ROLLSTONE HILL FITCHBURG
OFF 841 LOWELL ROAD GROTON
OFF 38 PINNACLE RD HARVARD
OFF 149 WINSOR RD LANCASTER
853.0875 854.4375 855.6625 856.3875 857.2125 858.9625

WRMI363
ADAMS HILL E OF BEARSDEN RD ATHOL
Thresher Rd Hardwick
0.65 km north of Frizzell Hill Road and East Hill Road LEYDEN
OFF ELLIS ROAD MONTAGUE
38 Blueberry Hill Rd New Salem
320 Daniel Shays Highway Pelham
851.4125 851.6875 852.3375 852.425 852.6875 853.05 853.7125 856.8875 857.8875 858.0125

WRMI365
PROSPECT HILL PHILLIPSTON
MOUNT SHELBURNE OLD ALBANY RD SHELBURNE
MT TOBY STATE FOREST SUNDERLAND
MOUNT GRACE AVE WARWICK
HIGH STREET & EAGLE RD WINCHENDON
851.4125 851.6875 852.3375 852.425 852.6875 853.05 853.7125 856.8875 857.8875 858.0125

WRMI364
TOWER ROAD MENDON
OXFORD FIRE OBSERVATION TOWER OXFORD
610 ALDRICH ST UXBRIDGE
OFF DOUGLAS ROAD WEBSTER
OFF BATCHELLOR RD WHITINSVILLE
851.5375 852.5375 855.1875 855.3625 855.8875 857.9125 858.8375 859.3625

There is an attachment to all the FCC applications for "slow growth" with a tentative timeline for build outhttps://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsEntry/atta ... applAttach

n1riw
Posts: 86
Joined: 04 Sep 2005 11:00

Re: CoMIRS Eastern Mass. Project 25 Phase 2?

Post by n1riw »

I believe in the Cape there are a half dozen 700 mhz freqs licensed. Someone told me in a previous forum the existing 800 freqs would eventually migrate to the new system which would make sense since you have about 35 local PD/FD agencies plus state users in the area.

Post Reply